[Rule-list] The state of the installer message

[Chuck Moss]

On Mon, Feb 25, 2002 at 09:24:54PM -0500, Devon wrote:
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> OK, a few random thoughts on progress and direction.
> 
> I think we all agree that it would be wonderful if Red Hat were to 
> include the ability to install in lower memory machines. For this to 
> happen, I'd think any changes we make to anaconda would need 
> to isolated, perhaps as a new install method.

I was thinking an option available in expert mode or a lowmem flag at the
command line.


> 
> We can easily modify the MIN_RAM requirement, for example. Red Hat, 
> however, isn't going to want to see that lowered overall. They don't want 
> people trying to do a full install in 12M of RAM (and they will), because 
> when it fails, (and it will) it would reflect badly on Red Hat. Stock 
> holders don't like bad publicity. ;)

I don't think RH will want to modify the MIN_RAM for all installs.
I think a lowmem install class which isn't very visible might fly.

> 
> To solve this, perhaps we could add a little code to the memory test. If 
> memory < 10000, sorry, can't be done, exit. If memory < 17000, display 
> disclamer, offer only the 'lowmem' install classes, and a slimmed down 
> comps file. Offer to quit or continue. 
> Just something to consider.
> 
> Another possibility that shouldn't be too difficult to add is the ability 
> to skip partitioning, and perhaps formatting. (This is already done on a 
> hard drive based install, as you can't format the drive containing the 
> ISOs.) This would speed things up in low memory situations, and allow 
> swap to be turned on very early. Perhaps if usable partitions exist, 
> offer to format them, offer to turn on swap, etc. I haven't really 
> thought this through, but it seems like a path worth consideration. The 
> ability to create and format these partitions outside the installer would 
> be useful, of course.

The pre-formatted swap is an interesting recent development.  We will have
to follow up on that potential.

> 
> The reason I bring this up is that I believe we have hit the low end of 
> the memory limit, while continuing to use anaconda and a stock Red Hat 
> distribution. I believe that limit is going to be ~12M. Yes, with more 
> changes, we could possibly slim it down more, but I doubt Red Hat would 
> be interested in supporting that ability. On top of that, how many end 
> users would be willing to endure a basic install that takes 12 -16 or 
> more hours, resulting in a machine that uses 98% of the cpu time just 
> managing swap? Swap is a wonderful thing, but it isn't a substitute for 
> RAM. Can you imagine trying to compile a kernel or rebuild a large RPM 
> under those circumstances?

Uggh. no.  I think we will accept that these machines may not have a full
development environment.  I am hoping we can get some use out of them.

> 
> I'm not trying to be negative, just realistic here. Red Hat has to 
> support what they sell, and isn't likely to want to deal with the support 
> calls a low memory install might generate.

Ideally what we generate will be acceptable for redhat to include in later
releases.  If we can't accomplish that then we can make our twekas
available as floppy images with huge disclaimers about redhat support not
being provided on lowmem machines.

Chuck


> 
> Thoughts, opinions, counter claims, flames?
> 
> - -D
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